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JuliSnyderArt
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on: July 17, 2013 09:32
I re-read everything that you guys posted and I'm a little confused. English to Elvish is tricky! I dunno how you guys do it! would you agree that this: Gwisto ech na nad i ben i onneg/onnel an nad - would be the most accurate translation? I'd like it to be as close as possible to "become who you were born to be"; not necessarily to mean to continue being who I was born to be. Do you think this would be much easier said in Quenya?
Thanks again SO much! You guys are the greatest!
Juli Snyder
Naruvir
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on: July 18, 2013 03:23
Hi again!
Yes, working with Tolkien's languages is very arduous sometimes! While I would hardly call myself an expert on Quenya, I believe the language offers the necessary words to phrase your sentence more accurately. Dirk_math and others, please verify this sentence!

Nai quen anel nostaina náve
Be the person you were born to be
ElfDict.com - an extensive dictionary dedicated to the languages of Middle Earth!
Cillendor
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on: July 23, 2013 12:51
Naruvir said:
Cillendor said:
What about this?
Gwisto ech na nad i ben i onneg/onnel an nad. / Change yourself to being the one who you were born for being.

Yes, I quite like where you are going with this. There are a few pointers I'd like to give though:

gwisto = gwista- (to change, from An Unexpected Journey) + -o (imperative ending)

I do not think the person, who will wear this ring, needs to change, but rather continue being the person he is. I feel I am nitpicking, but this might be an important distinction.


Actually, Naruvir, this verb "to change" is an intransitive verb. Gandalf says, "But age hasn't changed you," or something like that. So it seems to me to be a simple change over time, not a caused change. Anyway, I'm moving this over to the realelvish boards.
Hoy
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on: July 30, 2013 12:44
Could anyone help me with this translation?

"You will not win for I will not lose."
or
"The enemy will not win, for I refuse to lose."
Cillendor
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on: July 30, 2013 10:47
The first half of both of those is simple, but I don't know of a verb for "to lose" or a noun for "defeat". If anyone else can think of one, that'd be great.
Hoy
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on: July 31, 2013 09:20
What about if I reformulate?

"Thou wilt not triumph, for I wilt not fail/forfeit/surrender/yield."
Galadivren
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on: July 31, 2013 01:20
[ú-hevol/ú-gerol] [tûr/gell], an avo dewo

ú-hevol = thou wilt not possess
ú-gerol = thou wilt not hold
tûr = mastery, victory
gell = triumph, joy
an = for
avo = I will not, I refuse
dewo = fail

[Edited on 07/31/2013 by Galadivren]
Hoy
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on: July 31, 2013 08:40
Thanks a lot, Galadivren! Going to get this tattooed onto my forearm.
Cillendor
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on: July 31, 2013 10:26
Hoy, do you want it transcribed in Tengwar? I can write it out for you if you want, but pick the final version (where she gave you multiple options for words). I can probably get it posted by Friday.
Hoy
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on: August 01, 2013 08:28
That'd be great, Cillendor.

"ú-hevol tûr an avo dewo"
Cillendor
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on: August 02, 2013 09:16
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Hoy
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on: August 02, 2013 06:11
Thanks a lot, both of you. If I may ask, what does that mean? First the upper sentence that I recognise and then the lower writing.
Cillendor
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on: August 02, 2013 09:10
Both writings mean the same thing. When writing Sindarin (the language) with Tengwar (the alphabet), there are two different styles of writing, called modes. The top mode is the one you'll see more commonly. It's referred to as the tehtar mode because the vowels and other modifiers go above the letters. These modifier marks are called tehtar, and the letters themselves are called tengwar. (Ironically, these words all come from Quenya.)

The second example uses very few tehtar, and the vowels are given their own unique tengwar. It's more like the alphabet used for English in that regard.

Knowing this, try to identify what the different tengwar and tehtar mean. Some of them are exactly the same—most of the consonants stay the same, but three consonants change character between the first and second lines.

To give an example of how this works, consider Spanish. You can spell "Mexico" as either México or Méjico. Here, x and j have the same sound, but it is represented by two different letters.
silentwanderer
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on: August 03, 2013 09:58
Hi I've taken some of the Sindarin courses but direct translation is proving to be difficult. Would anyone mind telling me if these translations work and if not, suggesting a better way to say them?

Garestel, nai in giliath varyaldë -Have hope, may the stars protect you

Narr trî i annon -They are through the gate (but anything close to this would suffice)
Cillendor
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on: August 03, 2013 11:12
Well in the first one, garestel looks to be a simple typo, as gar- means "to hold" and estel means "hope". I'd recommend using the verb saf- instead, because it means "to possess", which works better with hope since you cannot hold it.

Now, to say "have hope", you need the imperative tense. For an i-stem verb (that is, a verb that doesn't end in the letter a), you must add i to the end of the verb and then change the other vowels. In this case, a > e, so you have sevi. (Gar- > geri.) So your first sentence would be Sevi estel.

Now with your next sentence, you're mixing Quenya and Sindarin. It's an easy mistake when you're first starting out, but it doesn't make any sense to someone reading it. I'll go ahead and translate the second sentence for you and then break it down so you can follow along.

I ngiliath/In elenath gi/le meriathar.

i ngiliath = i (the) + gil (star, bright spark) + -iath (collective plural) > in (the, plural) + giliath (all the stars) > nasal mutation > i ngiliath
in elenath = in (the, plural) + elin (archaic plural of el, star) + -ath (collective plural) > in elenath
You can use either here. I think elenath is more common, but that might just be because I use it more often myself.

gi = cin (you (informal)); the c mutates to g, and the n causes nasal mutation on the following verb
OR
le = len (you (formal)); the l doesn't mutate, but the n still causes nasal mutation

meriathar = beria- (to protect) + -atha- (future tense) + -r (3rd person plural) > beriathar > nasal mutation from the proceeding pronoun mutates the b to an m > meriathar

Sevi estel. I ngiliath/In elenath gi/le meriathar aen.
Have hope. The stars will protect you.

Now for your second one, I don't know what "narr" means. It's not a Sindarin word, and I don't think Quenya has the "rr" sound—certainly never at the end of a word. There is a proper Sindarin word for "they", though: ti.

So a literal translation of your second line would be, Ti trî i annon.

However, that doesn't really make sense in Sindarin. English uses the verb "to be" rather liberally, so when you say, "They are through the gate," you actually mean, "They have gone through the gate." To our knowledge, Sindarin only has one past tense (compared to our two in English: have gone/went), so the correct translation would be

Ti mennir trî i annon. or even Mennir trî i annon.

(In Sindarin, if the subject is a pronoun such as "they", you don't need to include it. The verb ending already includes it. In this case, it is -r.)

I hope this helps!

[Edited on 08/04/2013 by Cillendor]
Galadivren
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on: August 04, 2013 12:57
Can I ask why you've started using 'i' as the imperative ending on i-stem verbs? The universally used imperative ending is 'o' for both i and a-stem.

Men- is meant to take the irregular past tense Evennir.

Regarding El/Gil - the former is only for poetic or if we're writing something meant to be 'early', the third age word is gil.

[Edited on 08/04/2013 by Galadivren]
Cillendor
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on: August 04, 2013 03:16
D'OH! You're right, Galadivren! I thought I had my verb conjugations memorized and was just going off of memory, but I got that one completely wrong. Sorry, silentwanderer!

Ah, thanks for clearing that up. I have a thought for the dictionary that I will send to you via message.

I did not know that about el/gil. I assumed they were completely interchangeable. Thanks for that as well.

So, silentwanderer, the REAL correct translation would be:

Savo estel. I ngiliath gi/le meriathar.
Have hope. The stars will protect you.

Also, ignore the word aen in the previous post. I had put it there initially and later decided it didn't fit, but I forgot to remove it. And remember that gi is for someone like a close friend, spouse, family member, or someone younger, while le is for someone older, someone you don't know well, or someone close to whom you want to show respect.
blomme
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on: August 07, 2013 02:47
Maybee someone in here can help me.

Can someone translate:
I will not say do not weep for not all tears are an evil

And can someone spell it in tengwar?
Cillendor
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on: August 08, 2013 07:00
Sorry for the late reply!

Avon peded an avo nínio, sui nîn úbain ogol
I refuse saying to not weep, as not all tears are evil.

It'd be good for someone else to confirm this before I transcribe it in Tengwar.
Galadivren
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on: August 09, 2013 03:25
I prefer the imperative with ava- =

Avon pedo avo ninio = I will not say do not weep
blomme
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on: August 12, 2013 06:21
A friend of a friend says that its: Ava-pednye, ú-nír, al-pain nîn guid???
Galadivren
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on: August 12, 2013 01:42
Er... no. There's no suffix in Sindarin for 'nye', I assume that's Quenya if anything. Al- is a Doriathrin negative particle, but why use it *and* ú in the same sentence?
nír is not a verb for 'to weep' (or a verb at all), we have the reconstructed nínia- for that.
Ava- is a verb stem, the verb 'to refuse' that we have used, but you can't just use a stem, it needs endings attached to it or it's meaningless. Avon is the verb Ava- plus the first person present tense ending -on, making it 'I refuse' or 'I am refusing', that attached to the imperative form of ped- (to say, to speak) makes it mean 'I refuse to say'.
blomme
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on: August 12, 2013 02:44
Ok. I just want it to be correct. It means a lot to me!
blomme
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on: August 12, 2013 02:47
So it doesn't say something like 'big titties' or something
Cillendor
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on: August 12, 2013 11:55
lol no one here would do that to you.

With Galadivren's correction, here is the final result:

Avon pedo avo nínio, sui nîn úbain ogol.
I refuse to say do not weep, as not all tears are evil.

Image
blomme
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on: August 13, 2013 06:30
Thank you so much!!! It means more to me than I can describe!!!

The first is that in tengwar? Nr 2 looks like the letters of mordor, like my ring...
blomme
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on: August 14, 2013 03:23
I see now that its the same
Cillendor
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on: August 15, 2013 12:21
You'd be right about the ring letters! The font is called "Tengwar Annatar", and it is modeled after the writing on the One Ring. When Sauron forged the rings, he called himself Annatar, so the font is named after him.
instoresnow
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on: August 15, 2013 12:57
Hi! Hello! I was wondering if someone could translate for me "Don't tell the elf" For reasons. And if maybe you could explain to me how you got there? Thank you
Galadivren
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on: August 15, 2013 02:18
ú-bedo nad na i edhel = Don't say something to the elf

ú negates pedo which is the imperative of ped- = to say, speak, making it 'do not speak'
nad = something, a thing
na = to
i = the
edhel = elf

na + i can also be combined into nan = to the

Edit - if I used the verb nara- = to tell, it would make it 'Don't tell a tale to the Elf' incidentally, nara- is 'to tell a tale'.

[Edited on 08/15/2013 by Galadivren]
instoresnow
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on: August 15, 2013 02:56
Mmmyes, thank you.
Bronadui
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on: August 27, 2013 12:25
Hi all!

Can one of you help me with finding a 1:1 translation for "Unbreakable" and "Enduring" in any of the Tolkein languages? I found out that my nick was the translation for "Enduring" in Sindarin, but wanted to make sure.

Also, would love it if someone could show me how these (the Tolkein words) would be written in Tengwar Annatar Italic (and maybe some other fonts as well, would like options if possible).

Thank you in advance!

[Edited on 08/28/2013 by Bronadui]

[Edited on 08/30/2013 by Bronadui]
McBeefsteak
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on: September 09, 2013 09:39
Hey everyone,  

I'm hoping you can all help me. I'm looking to have a name and a phrase translated into Sindarin and then transcribed in Tengwar. Tolkien's work sparked my lifelong affair with literature and I want to capture that in a new tattoo but having seen so many that are just gibberish I want to make sure mine is correct and this seems to be THE place to ask. I've attempted to learn some on my own but don't trust my own understanding. So without further preamble here's what I was looking for help with.  

I'd like to translate my name and my sons name. My name is James, coking from Jacob meaning he who supplants while my sons is Luther which I've seen referred to as famous warrior or literally the combination of two germania roots people and army. I'm unsure whether it's more appropriate to translate the meaning or the actual "word" as it were but thought someone here could also answer that.  

The phrase I'd like to translate is Sursum Specto which translates from Latin to English as "I look upward" or "I look heavenward"  

I really appreciate the expertise that this community represents and would be super grateful for your help! Let me know if there is any additional information that would be needed.
Cillendor
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on: September 09, 2013 02:26
Hi!

From the Elvish Names Database, we get Mebedir, "one who takes" (from maba- to take). Luther doesn't have an entry, so the next step is to confirm a definition on WikiNames. "Famous warrior" it is.

This might be problematic. "Famous warrior" is maethor balan-hinnen. There is a root, BER, that I *might* be able to work into something meaning "great warrior", but it'd be highly speculative.

As for the rest, I will look at it after work. I have to leave soon.

[Edited on 09/10/2013 by Cillendor]
McBeefsteak
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on: September 09, 2013 02:40
Yeah I'd seen the one on elvish names database and had also seen one on Arwin-Undomiel.com translated as Neurion which it says is the word for Successor with a masculine suffix. It seems it's a good thing I asked!
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